A Gardeners Forum
Posted By: LandOfOz Tomato Yield and Support - March 6th, 2007 at 06:44 PM
I'm growing a lot of different tomato varieties this year. Specifically, I'm growing break o'day, brandywine OTV, Mexico Midget, F1 Sungold, Ace 55, Big Beef, Adelia, and Rose de Berna. I plan on doing a LOT of canning. How many plants would you plant to get a large yield for diced tomatoes and salsa? Obviously the cherry-sized tomatoes probably won't be useful for that, but what about the others?

Second question: I love JohnCt's beautiful cages but unless someone is going to build me a shed, I have no room for the cages during off-season. I really don't care for staking. Is there another method/technique that I could do which doesn't require a lot of storing space?

Thanks!
Posted By: MLN Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 6th, 2007 at 07:00 PM
I can't help you with the support issue since I stake my tomatoes. But, I plant 18-20 regular tomato plants for chopped tomatoes, juice and salsa. This gives me enough tomatoes for approx. 25 jars of chopped tomatoes (mostly quarts), several pints of salsa, several pints of okra and tomatoes, and several quarts of juice (for soup). Then I put in about 12-14 Romas for thick sauce and usually get about 25 quarts from them. This is plenty for me and hubby (kids are grown and gone) and allows me plenty for table use and sharing with friends and family which always puts a great big wink on their faces!
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 6th, 2007 at 07:34 PM
So, I'm up to about 20 plants needed. Geesh, that's gonna take up a lot of garden-space. But I think it will be worth it in January when I'm opening a jar of homemade tomatoes!

After the experience I had last year with Roma's, I'm not sure I'm willing to even touch them this year. They were nothing but BER or they didn't produce at all. Trust me, I'm now very educated on BER! laugh I just think it was too hot and too dry last year for them. It was such a disappointment!
Posted By: MLN Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 7th, 2007 at 06:55 PM
I had a real bad year with my tomatoes last year too. Just too hot and dry. That's one reason I put up extra on the good years--there are always those years when something in the garden doesn't do too good so I put up enough to carry me through an extra year if necessary. Last year my cukes didn't do any good either so I hope to get lots of our favorite sweet pickles made this year. Good luck on your canning. I enjoy it.
Posted By: johnCT Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 7th, 2007 at 08:34 PM
Sarah, I am unfamiliar with the productivity of most of your varieties. Best thing to do is plant as many as you have room for. You'd be suprised how easy it is to find use for them all, especially when you can some of them.

As far as other support methods, staking and caging are the most common, but you could also just let them sprawl. Many people do this, but I wouldn't. The other method is called the Florida Weave. It uses string and stakes. Just do a google search and you'll see pics.
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 7th, 2007 at 10:20 PM
I am not a sprawling type of person. I'm very obsessive when it comes to my garden. Everything goes where it should, and it had better not even try to go anywhere else! laugh

The Florida weave looks promising, but do you think the twine "cuts into" the stems cutting off circulation? Would something like that withstand strong winds? Then again, if set parallel to prevailing summer winds, that should be less likely to blow over than being put perpendicular, right? Only problem is we got strong south winds and storms blow in from the east. But I've got trees to the east that should serve as a wind block, at least a little bit...
Posted By: markr Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 7th, 2007 at 11:37 PM
my dad used to grow his in the border, then he just tied them into the fence with string.
Posted By: Amigatec Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 8th, 2007 at 01:22 AM
You could try on one these; Tomato Trellis

I bought one this year and it is like a net. I comes in a very small package. Just buy some T-posts to hang it on. I was thinking about using Electric Fence wire guides for hanging it on.

As far as planting them, I planted 24 plants last year on a 25 foot row. I planted them in pairs, with each plant about 6" apart the pair about 18" apart. Worked good for me.
Posted By: tkhooper Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 8th, 2007 at 02:42 PM
Hey Sarah, I powdered a bunch of egg shells last year so if you need some for spreading over your tomato patch prior to tilling I'll be happy to send you some. It certainly stopped me from having to deal with the BER on my roma's last year. The difference was amazing between first and second year. Really amazing. I trench rather than stake so I don't know anything about different support structures. This year I'm just doing a few container tomatoes. Can't wait to see how that works.
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 8th, 2007 at 03:59 PM
I go through about a dozen or so eggs a week and I've been smashing them up and putting them out there for a year or two now. I'm not powdering them though. Are they still going to breakdown and be usable for this years crop?
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 8th, 2007 at 04:49 PM
Quote
Originally posted by LandOfOz:
Are they still going to breakdown and be usable for this years crop?
*You can put them in a gallon sized zip lock baggies, and then close it up and smash it up inside, then it's all contained and you don't lose any.. teech How ever sometimes they poke a bit of a tiny hole in the baggie, if it's really sharp or pointy...

And they don't really break down, they leach out like, and then the roots, going thru the soil, can utilize what they leach out, it takes quite a while for them to finally breakdown.....
Posted By: johnCT Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 8th, 2007 at 07:18 PM
Egg shells are a great source of calcium for the soil Sarah.
Posted By: Deborah L. Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 8th, 2007 at 08:05 PM
I think the absolute worst support is that common tomato tower thing you see everywhere in the garden stores. They aren't tall enough or strong enough and they look awful too.
I gave that up the first year I tried them and now all I use is cedar stakes and twine.
I rather enjoy the sun-warmed scent of the vines while I'm twining away...
Posted By: Amigatec Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 9th, 2007 at 01:16 AM
I have probably a dozen Tomato cages, I'm going to use them this year it all. I did buy Electric Fence wire supports today to use the hold the Tomato trellis up.
Posted By: Deborah L. Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 9th, 2007 at 02:06 AM
Gulp...hope I didn't step on any toes? shocked
Posted By: johnCT Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 9th, 2007 at 01:24 PM
No Deb, you're absolutely right about those cheap cages. They work great for peppers though.
Posted By: elkwc36 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 9th, 2007 at 02:25 PM
Sarah,
I'm planting the Adelia. I think it should do well for you depends on the year. It seems to do better in the heat and drought than many others.
I use both cages and let others sprawl. My sprawlers usually produce a little more than my caged plants. I have 2 acres so not a problem. Also they don't need as much shade and windbreak with the winds and heat here in SW KS. I understand why most don't let them sprawl but it works for me and 50 cages is all I want to handle every year. I have seen several methods even where they just make half cages. I've been thinking of trying that. Would stack a lot better in the off season. I have some seeds of the other varieties you are planting but haven't grown them yet. Best of luck gardening in 07. Jay
Posted By: RedReno Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 9th, 2007 at 02:27 PM
elkwc,
when you lte your tomatoes sprawl,
does the plant and tomotoes get dirty?
or do you put something under them so
no dirt gets on them?

ann
Posted By: elkwc36 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 9th, 2007 at 02:34 PM
Sarah,
Have you started your seeds yet. I have started my pepper seeds and will start the first batch of tomato seeds this weekend. It has been hard for me to wait. I got in too big of a hurry last year. Just curious when others here in KS were starting.
I will be growing Break O' Day also. So will be interested to compare results later. I will have around 50 varieties planted so will post any that does well. Jay
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 9th, 2007 at 03:14 PM
I planted my peppers in mid-January, expecting them to take a month to germinate. Instead they were up in a week. So I've got several fairly tall peppers in the house. Unfortunately a few seeds were collected from gardens and were mutant (mis-shapen leaves, leaves growing out the side of other leaves) so I'm probably going to have to sacrifice those and purchase some seedlings.

I just started my tomatoes this week. In fact, I ran out of pots to plant them in, so I've been forcing OJ and Soy milk on my kids like crazy, so I can have the cartons. I will be keeping an eye out to see how your tomatoes are doing, Jay.
Posted By: elkwc36 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 10th, 2007 at 05:39 AM
Reno,
No I haven't ever had that trouble. I do mulch fairly heavy around them. Probably had 6" by the end of the summer last year. Then work it in in the fall. My soil looks nice right now. It is dry enough here I've never had any problems with rot ect. I lose less tomatoes by sprawling. Just my experience. Jay
Posted By: Dixie Angel Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 10th, 2007 at 06:08 AM
Quote
expecting them to take a month to germinate. Instead they were up in a week.
Don't you be scaring me now, Sarah! I planted mine last week and I see elbows sprouting already..... shk
Posted By: MLN Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 10th, 2007 at 05:30 PM
RedReno,
I have let tomatoes sprawl before but I always mulch pretty heavy for a good ways out from each plant with wheat straw. That way when it rains, my tomatoes stay nice and clean.
Posted By: monajean Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 11th, 2007 at 09:44 PM
JohnCT,
I live in northern central Arkansas and am in zone 6. How can you be in zone 6 in Conneticut?
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 11th, 2007 at 10:26 PM
MonaJean,
Click Here for a Growing Zone Map for USA
Posted By: elkwc36 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 11th, 2007 at 11:52 PM
Weezie,
Hope your season is starting great. Mine is coming along good now that the snow is gone. Tilled it again yesterday and done except for some light tilling and cultivating later. Have onions coming in this week and yesterday got a call and got a free load of grass clippings. They are cleaning the ball fields and I like I told you last year I get all I want. So will start mulching onions as soon as I get them in the ground. I worked at least 6" in last fall and the ground really looks great. Still haven't started that compost pile you suggested. Have a great 07 in the garden. Jay
Posted By: Amigatec Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 12th, 2007 at 12:21 AM
You can never have to much organic matter in the ground. I expanded my garden by 5' this year and added about 4" of mostly rotted wood chips to the new spot. It is nice and loose I will be planting tomatoes their this year, hope it will by a good year.

Where I added the really rotted chips last year I planted my tomatoes, I had more tomatoes last year than I could handle.
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 12th, 2007 at 12:33 AM
Quote
Originally posted by elkwc36:
Weezie,
Hope your season is starting great. Mine is coming along good now that the snow is gone. Tilled it again yesterday and done except for some light tilling and cultivating later.
Jay,
My season is still in WINTER!! wink laugh laugh

And the tomato cages' I have that I left out alllll winter shocked :rolleyes: eek are barely pokin' out from the top of the snow!!! :p

It'll be quite some time yet for me to even walk to my garden!!!
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 12th, 2007 at 12:36 AM
Sarah,
Here's some Collaspable Tomato Cages...
Just an idea... but they ain't cheap!!!
**Know anyone that could fashion some of those?**

Here\'s some more foldable tomato cages...

Click here for some wooden one\'s... thumbup
*now these look really neat...
Posted By: johnCT Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 12th, 2007 at 11:30 AM
Quote
Originally posted by monajean:
JohnCT,
I live in northern central Arkansas and am in zone 6. How can you be in zone 6 in Conneticut?
Monajean, many people don't realize that planting zones have nothing to do with high temperatures. thumbup
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 19th, 2007 at 02:03 PM
Weezie, you are quite right--those aren't cheap! And with around 20 plants, that is crazy expensive. I wonder how sturdy those are--the wire doesn't look very strong.

I am still pondering over exactly where to put up the tomato trellis. I have a 20x15 foot garden and can't decide if I want the trellis to go North and south (20 feet) or east and west(15 feet). I'll probably plant upwards of 20 plants, maybe 25. Decisions, decisions.
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 19th, 2007 at 02:10 PM
I had my husband take 2 x 4's and cut them length wise down the middle..
And pound them puppies in to the ground...
Posted By: carino Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 02:59 AM
I too make mine out of wood. I use 1X6 cedar boards and cut them to size on my table saw. I have the same ones I have used for the past 5 years. After the season is over, I just take them apart and store them. Cedar is expensive but....the wood lasts a very long time.
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 11:50 AM
Yeah, a couple of mine have broke off
on the bottom few inches *(from being left :rolleyes: shocked )*
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 02:30 PM
I tried staking mine last year, but it breaks my heart to cut the top off the plant. I just can't do it. laugh
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 02:40 PM
The only time I cut the top
(or tips really)
is at the end of the season to
hurry up the rippening process
if they're lagging and time is short...

Why do you cut yours???
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 03:04 PM
Mine grow taller than the stakes and snap or shred as they droop over the top.
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 03:10 PM
ahhhhhhh, gotchya!!

Not that I always get mine done this way,
*cause I'm way layed or sidetracked..

But I have taken clothes line string and
strung in in a web like fashion thru all the stakes..
*maybe like 3 layers high*

Then as the tomato plants grow higher/taller
it grows up thru the weblike strings, which hold them up..
Then if they happen to grow taller than the stakes and weblike structure..
They flop over on top of that web...

*I've done it years ago, but no picture*

*I even found some pretty colored string,
one for each layer too, gave some excitement to doing the job and I could tell how high up it
was on each colored string..*
Posted By: LandOfOz Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 06:55 PM
That is a great idea. Do you ever walk into the web? I'm always running into my clothesline (which is right next to the garden) and choking myself. Then I have to look around, too make sure no one saw me!
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 22nd, 2007 at 08:31 PM
No, can't..
I have raised beds, so, I'd have to jump up
and get into the bed to do that...
Posted By: joyce.225 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 25th, 2007 at 12:42 PM
I grow too many tomatoes and peppers to cage them it would cost me a fortune, I'm on a fixed income (retired). I have always used stakes, this year I will be using trellises for all my tomatoes and peppers. I can plant more and use both sides for support and planting.
joyce
Posted By: weezie13 Re: Tomato Yield and Support - March 25th, 2007 at 01:20 PM
I hope you keep us posted, and with a picture or two from the trellis's... I would love to see it..
REALLLLLLY, I love new projects/idea's...
So does everyone else..


Head on over to the NEW FORUM Joyce,225

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